NERF GUNNERS

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Should rob do something?

yes
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no
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Total votes : 30

NERF GUNNERS

Postby Contracter » Fri Jul 25, 2014 5:57 pm

Gunners with rubbish stats are grinding beholders RUBBISH.
The speed and base weapon damage are an OP combination.
its like an archers base damage but way faster than if an archer spammed triple shot.
Cowboys need serious damage or speed reduction.
And when it comes to classes people are bias ..Period.
if your a gunner you'll feel that you dont want to be nerfed same way i was pissed with mages having the lowest base weapon damage of all classes and now the with the update damage is almost purely weapon based. One base weapon damage is a lot now.. my particles dont hit noobs i have to direct wand whack them...
Well without further ado the nub that cna now kill beholders I KNOW FOR SURE THEY COULDNT BEFORE THE UPDATE
gunners.png
gunners.png (109.62 KiB) Viewed 1100 times

AND WITHOUT RAGE WITHOUT RAGE
gunnersgridnkreeton.png
gunnersgridnkreeton.png (36.04 KiB) Viewed 1100 times
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Re: NERF GUNNERS

Postby MI74 » Fri Jul 25, 2014 6:40 pm

I thought this was a suggestion to add Nerf Guns :(
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Re: NERF GUNNERS

Postby SlapThatChicken » Sat Jul 26, 2014 3:41 pm

The Archers and mages can also do this early and you complaining about cowboys? Admittedly it really cause they can rapid fire without the need for MP, if mages weren't nerfed on their MP, you be complaining about mages(you wouldn't tho, you a mage urself lol) instead as everyone can fight them early now. I can damage reps with low stats but it not convenient...

I would say warrior can also fight these very early, easily in fact in term of damage, but they would die too often, warrior can damage them well before any class should be able to.

Edit: also based on the pic, seems fine to me, i was farming those at one point before with around near 800 artillery and it still takes time to down the mobs, meanwhile a mage was running around owning them so... I don't see the problem, especially since with that guy's damage, he be fighting one mob for way too long that the time it took him to kill it, he should have farmed 3-6 stalkers by now.
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Re: NERF GUNNERS

Postby itblobboy » Sat Jul 26, 2014 4:15 pm

I don't care what class he is, if his offensive stat is under 400 and he is grinding at beholders something's wrong.
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Re: NERF GUNNERS

Postby MisoSoup247 » Sat Jul 26, 2014 5:08 pm

SlapThatChicken wrote:The Archers and mages can also do this early and you complaining about cowboys?.

As an archer from level 1 that DOES NOT SPAM BUY BOOKS, I can say you are completely wrong about archers being able to do this early, heck we do this LATE.
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Re: NERF GUNNERS

Postby Stabber » Sat Jul 26, 2014 5:13 pm

Cowboys are perfectly balanced. Its their weapons that aren't. They should scale by their damage per second, not by their damage per shot.
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Re: NERF GUNNERS

Postby itblobboy » Sat Jul 26, 2014 5:16 pm

Stabber wrote:Cowboys are perfectly balanced. Its their weapons that aren't. They should scale by their damage per second, not by their damage per shot.


Not exactly... While all classes have to consume much more MP on special skills, cowboys notably have the least need to consume MP for their average day in the grinding chamber. They're barely affected by it at all when I see them. Then they've got the high dps and pretty good range...

Frankly I question myself for not seeing it sooner :?

I mean, compared to archers, their range isn't a huge downside. Plus their bullets travel extremely fast compared to arrows, and archers have very low dps. Best edge they have is arrow rain, and that takes MP like a mothertrucker now I imagine.
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Re: NERF GUNNERS

Postby SlapThatChicken » Sat Jul 26, 2014 11:40 pm

But if you had tried this with stats being around the same as gunners, they too can start damaging beholders and kreetons. The fact is attack vs. defense has change drastically in PvE but I find this for the better cause before unless you was extremely elite, you couldn't hope to even come close to this less A) you grinded for weeks to be able to do that in the old formula or B) you had to buy tickets and sell them to start book abusing your character.

Like I said on the other part however which I do agree with, is that really it the fact gunners can do this with next to no MP consumption in the new formula, by around 700+ stats artillery can handle these mobs.

Archer does similiar damage per hit at the same stat and damage range weapon but it a lot slower per shot, that where the issue lies, cowboys can shoot at rapid pace where the archer got to take their time.

Then there the mage, no doubt they can farm it but it would take so much MP, thus pointing back to the fact cowboys have not much need to spend MP so another win on cowboy's part.

If i was to balance the game myself based on that, I would have made the archer least get better damage per shot with their bows, why? Cause there a NPC near the start of the game that try to claim arrows hit harder than bullets... It should actually start doing that cause right now bows is on par with guns but NOT when it comes to fire rate (edit: which makes no sense to me why the archer don't do bigger damage with their spacebar to make up for that). As far as mages go... since the issue is with their MP being spent, I have no idea.
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Re: NERF GUNNERS

Postby itblobboy » Sun Jul 27, 2014 1:54 am

Archers do seem a bit weak per arrow. Even though they can spam them everywhere, the delay is annoying when they are using a spacebar attack like a non nublet...

So I wouldn't say no to the proposal to make arrows more powerful with all but arrow rain. Would be a nice balancing factor to make arrow rain weaker. Like you guys say, it has to be pulled down by gravity before it hits things, so I mean... It lost the propulsion of the bow's power, it's gravity at work and that's probably not as powerful anyway.
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Re: NERF GUNNERS

Postby plak&shlak » Sun Jul 27, 2014 5:37 am

Contracter wrote:Gunners with rubbish stats are grinding beholders RUBBISH.
The speed and base weapon damage are an OP combination.
its like an archers base damage but way faster than if an archer spammed triple shot.
Cowboys need serious damage or speed reduction.
And when it comes to classes people are bias ..Period.
if your a gunner you'll feel that you dont want to be nerfed same way i was pissed with mages having the lowest base weapon damage of all classes and now the with the update damage is almost purely weapon based. One base weapon damage is a lot now.. my particles dont hit noobs i have to direct wand whack them...
Well without further ado the nub that cna now kill beholders I KNOW FOR SURE THEY COULDNT BEFORE THE UPDATE
gunners.png

AND WITHOUT RAGE WITHOUT RAGE
gunnersgridnkreeton.png

well that one of the results new formula
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Re: NERF GUNNERS

Postby Seta » Sun Jul 27, 2014 11:48 am

itblobboy wrote:Archers do seem a bit weak per arrow. Even though they can spam them everywhere, the delay is annoying when they are using a spacebar attack like a non nublet...

So I wouldn't say no to the proposal to make arrows more powerful with all but arrow rain. Would be a nice balancing factor to make arrow rain weaker. Like you guys say, it has to be pulled down by gravity before it hits things, so I mean... It lost the propulsion of the bow's power, it's gravity at work and that's probably not as powerful anyway.

i agree with this
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Re: NERF GUNNERS

Postby SlapThatChicken » Sun Jul 27, 2014 1:14 pm

If you guys serious about nerfing cowboys, the better way would have been to make more weight to those that have slower rate of fire on the guns. Make fast firing guns have less weight to each hit.

If you look at the bazooka, it pitiful considering you going to attack so much slower with it (laughably it will still beat any archer bow).

Make super fast firing weapons much much weaker, that was how guns most times work, if you got more power in a gun, you probably more than likely firing slower as well. A sub machine gun for example has high rate of fire while being weak each hit usually, while a rocket launcher should be slow but will blow the heck out of anything it hits.

Guns right now in HH don't currently reflect this, chain gun currently hit as hard as many mini nukes with the right set up which currently makes no sense.
Last edited by SlapThatChicken on Sun Jul 27, 2014 1:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: NERF GUNNERS

Postby fallenangel » Sun Jul 27, 2014 1:22 pm

MI74 wrote:I thought this was a suggestion to add Nerf Guns :(

Me too
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Re: NERF GUNNERS

Postby plak&shlak » Sun Jul 27, 2014 3:29 pm

SlapThatChicken wrote:If you guys serious about nerfing cowboys, the better way would have been to make more weight to those that have slower rate of fire on the guns. Make fast firing guns have less weight to each hit.

If you look at the bazooka, it pitiful considering you going to attack so much slower with it (laughably it will still beat any archer bow).

Make super fast firing weapons much much weaker, that was how guns most times work, if you got more power in a gun, you probably more than likely firing slower as well. A sub machine gun for example has high rate of fire while being weak each hit usually, while a rocket launcher should be slow but will blow the heck out of anything it hits.

Guns right now in HH don't currently reflect this, chain gun currently hit as hard as many mini nukes with the right set up which currently makes no sense.

he is right!
well i give a theard and i show that the chain gun is the strongest.. and i dont see people with other guns
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Re: NERF GUNNERS

Postby SlapThatChicken » Sun Jul 27, 2014 6:08 pm

Well let me use a example of how it been so far at least for the most part when it comes to guns... This is what making round per minute a problem.

Level 111 Machine Gun: Power 80-104, RPM 257...

Level 128 Chain Gun: Power 82-106, RPM "900"

Level 170 Bazooka: power 125-155, RPM 120

Level 190 Rayon Gun: Power 105-111, RPM 225

In this example you probably thinking "well the bazooka is better right?" No cause the RPM is so low enough vs. power that it don't make up for the lack of DPS the bazooka dish out, the bazooka should have gotten higher power to make up for that but it doesn't.

Now look at the other 2 guns that hope to compete against the Chain gun... You see the problem here? RPM on the chain gun is SO high that it like... why would you want them? They be a massive downgrade vs. the Chain gun...

When I played thru with the Cowboy this is literally all I used before the formula was changed and still might not changed with the new formula when it comes to grinding and leveling up further...

Get whatever gun, get enough money and level for ES C90, stick with that, till Chain gun, get Chain gun, never change weapons again less something obviously better comes out...

This... is where the problem lies, I could talk about the other classes problems but right now since the thread is about cowboys, there you go.
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Re: NERF GUNNERS

Postby plak&shlak » Mon Jul 28, 2014 7:07 am

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Re: NERF GUNNERS

Postby SlapThatChicken » Mon Jul 28, 2014 2:32 pm

Sorry, I just got kinda into posting, yeah I know you did, I was just making it more clear cause it a bit hard to read what you have.
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Re: NERF GUNNERS

Postby plak&shlak » Mon Jul 28, 2014 3:01 pm

SlapThatChicken wrote:Sorry, I just got kinda into posting, yeah I know you did, I was just making it more clear cause it a bit hard to read what you have.

well.. im trying
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Re: NERF GUNNERS

Postby Contracter » Mon Jul 28, 2014 4:15 pm

guunners only need 5oo to effectively grind beholders and kreetons phearsom has over 1000 defense and only 5oo and something artillery because he doesnt need any more than that .........
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Re: NERF GUNNERS

Postby SlapThatChicken » Mon Jul 28, 2014 6:12 pm

The stat itself not the problem, anyone with 500 stats and decent weapon can hurt them now so I don't really see the problem there, it just the way the chain gun itself is, 900 RPM was kinda overkill, so much that it sometimes don't actually shoot that much cause the game can't handle it.
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Re: NERF GUNNERS

Postby plak&shlak » Tue Jul 29, 2014 7:44 am

SlapThatChicken wrote:The stat itself not the problem, anyone with 500 stats and decent weapon can hurt them now so I don't really see the problem there, it just the way the chain gun itself is, 900 RPM was kinda overkill, so much that it sometimes don't actually shoot that much cause the game can't handle it.

this man should go to be a politician
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Re: NERF GUNNERS

Postby Phearsom » Tue Jul 29, 2014 12:00 pm

Hi Contracter,

It seems like you are unsatisfied with the changes to Helmet Heroes. It has always been my policy to adapt to changes in the game than expect the game to adapt to my play style. Please keep in mind that this new patch/changes effects all classes. You can test it out for wands, bows, swords, etc. with a decent amount of points in each of the separate stats to see the result. Nerfing gunners only is too bias due to your recent experience with other players that happens to be gunners, myself included.

My switch to a Gunner was actually a mistake. There seems to be a pet glitch that shows when you reset your points/stats that all the pet power/points only go into Artillery. My mistake for not knowing that if I added points in magic this would resolve itself. Therefore, I went gunner to save money/time than buy more tickets to reset yet again. I asked around and a good friend told me what was going on in game and I used that information to maximize my gaming experience.

In the game not everyone can be satisfied. We can only apply and play the best we can with what we get.

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Re: NERF GUNNERS

Postby Phearsom » Tue Jul 29, 2014 12:06 pm

On the record as well.. I still take a while to kill things due to my low points in Artillery. To clear fast I will exhaust most if not all of my MP. Let me know if there are anymore concerns that I may be able to help answer to the best of my knowledge..

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Re: NERF GUNNERS

Postby Contracter » Tue Jul 29, 2014 3:06 pm

Phearsom wrote:Hi Contracter,

It seems like you are unsatisfied with the changes to Helmet Heroes. It has always been my policy to adapt to changes in the game than expect the game to adapt to my play style. Please keep in mind that this new patch/changes effects all classes. You can test it out for wands, bows, swords, etc. with a decent amount of points in each of the separate stats to see the result. Nerfing gunners only is too bias due to your recent experience with other players that happens to be gunners, myself included.

My switch to a Gunner was actually a mistake. There seems to be a pet glitch that shows when you reset your points/stats that all the pet power/points only go into Artillery. My mistake for not knowing that if I added points in magic this would resolve itself. Therefore, I went gunner to save money/time than buy more tickets to reset yet again. I asked around and a good friend told me what was going on in game and I used that information to maximize my gaming experience.

In the game not everyone can be satisfied. We can only apply and play the best we can with what we get.

Phearsom

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Hmm wierd i can kill beholders and kreetons with 0 artillery
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Re: NERF GUNNERS

Postby Phearsom » Tue Jul 29, 2014 3:47 pm

Try using a wand, bow, sword, etc. The effect should be the same. Also will not be very effective or fast without a decent amount of points. It takes me maybe 4-5 seconds where if a person with higher points can one shot them or within 1-3 seconds. As we were running around at beholders you were able to kill them right out of my hands due to your points being higher in magic than mine in artillery.

To help clarify, this works for every class/job not just gunners.

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