Broken ticket economy?

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Broken ticket economy?

Postby SOUL_SLAYER » Fri Jun 20, 2014 8:37 am

I was in robot city today.
There seems to be a problem with the tickets.
The people who have sold them for 10k (or lower) have allowed so many people to buy them. But these people seem to have no intent on using them to purchase payvault items, only to sell them.
But the problem with that is that everyone has them already since the price dropped super low.
And since these people don't intend to use them to buy PV items, they won't get rid of them which is going to make ticket sales go stagnate.
The people who buy from payvault and sell them will have nobody buying them either since people are still trying to get rid of them. That means they will stop buying them from Rob. Ultimately Rob is going to start losing money on tickets.

I'm not sure how exactly we can resolve this now or if this really is a valid problem (hence the "?" in the title).
If I'm wrong somebody tell me but this seems to be what's happening.
Very similar to what happened with pets. Everyone will be selling them but nobody will be buying them due to a lack of decisive price to be put on them.
I feel the same might happen with rare items and such. for that same reason.
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Re: Broken ticket economy?

Postby YinFO » Fri Jun 20, 2014 9:03 am

It's all fine. robby's got it all under control.
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Re: Broken ticket economy?

Postby SOUL_SLAYER » Fri Jun 20, 2014 9:04 am

YinFO wrote:It's all fine. robby's got it all under control.


...How so?

EDIT:

I'd also like to point out how the game is becoming pay to win which is what originally brought me to HH seeing as how it was more or less fair to everyone.
GH0ST_SLAYER hes recently bought his way into the third player with most points spot on the leaderboards.
He has also began to bribe people to join his guild with MILLIONS of gold.
The perks tickets give people are nice but I feel some limitations need to be added.
Last edited by SOUL_SLAYER on Fri Jun 20, 2014 9:06 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Broken ticket economy?

Postby Pumpkin__King » Fri Jun 20, 2014 9:06 am

or robby increase the amount of tickets who buy from him, like:
50 tickets for .99$ and so on
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Re: Broken ticket economy?

Postby Naruto » Fri Jun 20, 2014 9:07 am

I swear I've said this before but my post in a certain thread got deleted. So I'll say it again.

Ticket prices will always fluctuate.

Real life ticket buyers will always be trying to sell tickets at a high price so that the amount of money gained from selling these tickets will be maximised in order to gain the highest amount of books possible. However, if they set the price too high, the non paying players will be unwilling to buy them meaning that there will be a surplus of tickets which
will cause Robby's income to stagnate.

Therefore, the best option to maximise the benefits and happiness for everyone is so that the real life ticket buyers set the ticket price at a price where the money gained from their ticket sales will be more than the money they make from grinding. This ticket price will also have to be agreeable with the non paying player's demands and this reasonable ticket pricing will ensure that the developer (Robby) will have a steady flow of income as well so that the game continues to run smoothly.

The problem, like you say is that players are buying tickets at 7K-10K each and are actually reselling them for higher prices. Eventually, the amount of 7K-10K tickets will decrease and then those tickets will be in the hands of ticket resellers who will try to raise the price to around 15K-35K. Other players will still be willing to buy but once the peak of ticket price raising reaches 50K, the amount of players buying tickets will dramatically decrease and as such the ticket prices will therefore decrease as well.

It's a continuous cycle. Give it two weeks to a month and ticket prices will be higher again because ticket re sellers will try to raise the price.
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Re: Broken ticket economy?

Postby SOUL_SLAYER » Fri Jun 20, 2014 9:08 am

Pumpkin__King wrote:or robby increase the amount of tickets who buy from him, like:
50 tickets for .99$ and so on


I don't see how that fixes anything I listed.
If anything that would make things worse, you're saying to give people 5x more tickets when people are still trying to figure out what to do with the surplus of tickets they have.
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Re: Broken ticket economy?

Postby itblobboy » Fri Jun 20, 2014 9:09 am

SOUL_SLAYER wrote:
Pumpkin__King wrote:or robby increase the amount of tickets who buy from him, like:
50 tickets for .99$ and so on


I don't see how that fixes anything I listed.
If anything that would make things worse, you're saying to give people 5x more tickets when people are still trying to figure out what to do with the surplus of tickets they have.


SOUL's not wrong, I do indeed have a surplus. :mrgreen:
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Re: Broken ticket economy?

Postby SlapThatChicken » Fri Jun 20, 2014 9:32 am

I must be one of the very few that bought cheaply and actually used the tickets for the PV stuff, i started with double jumping since in any platforming days, double jump is so useful.

Well if they can't seem to sell it, two things will happen, they'll resell it for the original price they got it from and eventually make back what they bought it for in their attempt to get a profit. Or Robby will release a new PV option later on that makes them actually use up all those extra tickets. I think eventually it will work out, if they having trouble selling them for higher pricing.

At least its tickets and not some cash item, I really hate when cash shops have cash items you can buy from other player but you can never get it, cause someone buys it to resell, only for some one to resell it, then it gets resell again by someone else, next thing you know, it cost a fortune only players that are selling other cash items can even get it so only the rich ever gets the thing.

Tickets is definitely a more fair thing, it just one thing and doesn't go out of control just cause it some popular item, I went kinda off topic but the point is that it will work itself out at least, that more than I can say for some games.
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Re: Broken ticket economy?

Postby Pumpkin__King » Fri Jun 20, 2014 9:35 am

itblobboy wrote:
SOUL_SLAYER wrote:
Pumpkin__King wrote:or robby increase the amount of tickets who buy from him, like:
50 tickets for .99$ and so on


I don't see how that fixes anything I listed.
If anything that would make things worse, you're saying to give people 5x more tickets when people are still trying to figure out what to do with the surplus of tickets they have.


SOUL's not wrong, I do indeed have a surplus. :mrgreen:


it will help to buyers of tickets and also robby
or increase the price of payvault items XD
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Re: Broken ticket economy?

Postby nickybear » Fri Jun 20, 2014 2:50 pm

i say to fix this problem forever is have rob change the payvault tickets for money to a higher amount of coins. For example where it says 400 tickets for 500k it should be 400 tickets for 8 million or so. This has been a HUGE problem for me, i have bought like 420 tickets no one will buy for 25 to 30k so i cant buy the darkane set. this will fix the problem by having the payvault buy the tickets by that price so you can have your coins to buy your items so you dont have to sell them ingame for 10k which is a huge profit decrease and will not be enough money for high level items. I just dont like the idea that people buy 1 THOUSAND REAL LIFE DOLLARS to buy like 7k tickets and sell them for 10k that is what destroying the ticket economy :?
who all agrees
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Re: Broken ticket economy?

Postby Caefer » Fri Jun 20, 2014 2:56 pm

I agree somewhat, though it could be viewed exactly the opposite way.

Also, nick, if you need some help getting the darkane set just let me know, i'd be happy to help you out.
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Re: Broken ticket economy?

Postby plak&shlak » Fri Jun 20, 2014 5:03 pm

waitttttttttttt
how robbyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy can control the bubble expode (like in hi tech in 2000) of the price of tickets?
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Re: Broken ticket economy?

Postby SlapThatChicken » Fri Jun 20, 2014 9:45 pm

Well in a sense if you make it where tickets can be turned in to the PV for much much higher in game money, the economy be even more screwed up, cause no one would be able to buy tickets cause people with tickets can get in game money a different way than selling them to the public.

Sell when the price is higher if you don't like selling at lower prices, it will eventually have to go up as much as I hate admitting this.
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Re: Broken ticket economy?

Postby Tomatha » Fri Jun 20, 2014 11:11 pm

... Let's hope the prices for payvault items don't skyrocket. (Only reason they wouldn't is that they cost real money.)

I think it'll all work itself out the second a new payvault item comes out (Assuming no one had gotten impatient and sold tens of thousands of tickets for 5k-10k.) I'm still waiting for people to shift their focus to the level 10's that have over 10k tickets and have never been seen before recently. Course, then again, could just be people buying tons of tickets and selling low for the lulz (Though I'm not sure how likely that would be.)
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Re: Broken ticket economy?

Postby M668 » Sun Jun 22, 2014 8:41 pm

While I don't want the tickets to be extremely overpriced (like 100K each), I also don't want the ticket to be too low (i.e. less than 10K each).
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Re: Broken ticket economy?

Postby SlapThatChicken » Sun Jun 22, 2014 10:36 pm

I made great use of those extremely low price tickets earlier, 9999 each was so cheap and I really needed some payvault stuff.
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Re: Broken ticket economy?

Postby Zywak » Wed Jun 25, 2014 3:59 am

SOUL_SLAYER wrote:The people who have sold them for 10k (or lower) have allowed so many people to buy them. But these people seem to have no intent on using them to purchase payvault items, only to sell them.
But the problem with that is that everyone has them already since the price dropped super low.
And since these people don't intend to use them to buy PV items, they won't get rid of them which is going to make ticket sales go stagnate.


I dont see a problem here. Resellers do not add to demand in the supply/demand model and demand is what makes sales rise. So when resellers dont buy anymore because they already have loads of tickets they cant sell for their high prices- it really doesnt matter.

EDIT: I actually like when tickets are low costed. This makes the game less pay-to-win.
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Re: Broken ticket economy?

Postby plak&shlak » Wed Jun 25, 2014 5:26 am

Zywak wrote:
SOUL_SLAYER wrote:The people who have sold them for 10k (or lower) have allowed so many people to buy them. But these people seem to have no intent on using them to purchase payvault items, only to sell them.
But the problem with that is that everyone has them already since the price dropped super low.
And since these people don't intend to use them to buy PV items, they won't get rid of them which is going to make ticket sales go stagnate.


I dont see a problem here. Resellers do not add to demand in the supply/demand model and demand is what makes sales rise. So when resellers dont buy anymore because they already have loads of tickets they cant sell for their high prices- it really doesnt matter.

EDIT: I actually like when tickets are low costed. This makes the game less pay-to-win.

well.. he is right
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Re: Broken ticket economy?

Postby Caefer » Thu Jun 26, 2014 8:55 am

plak&shlak wrote:
Zywak wrote:
SOUL_SLAYER wrote:The people who have sold them for 10k (or lower) have allowed so many people to buy them. But these people seem to have no intent on using them to purchase payvault items, only to sell them.
But the problem with that is that everyone has them already since the price dropped super low.
And since these people don't intend to use them to buy PV items, they won't get rid of them which is going to make ticket sales go stagnate.


I dont see a problem here. Resellers do not add to demand in the supply/demand model and demand is what makes sales rise. So when resellers dont buy anymore because they already have loads of tickets they cant sell for their high prices- it really doesnt matter.

EDIT: I actually like when tickets are low costed. This makes the game less pay-to-win.

well.. he is right

*Facepalm* not really, it just means they can sell more tickets in a shorter amount of time and people will buy them just because they are cheap. That all means they make more total money (because who can resist a good deal?)
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Re: Broken ticket economy?

Postby Tomatha » Thu Jun 26, 2014 9:31 am

Zywak wrote:
I dont see a problem here. Resellers do not add to demand in the supply/demand model and demand is what makes sales rise. So when resellers dont buy anymore because they already have loads of tickets they cant sell for their high prices- it really doesnt matter.


Regarding resellers that aren't selling- Doesn't removing from the supply have a very similar effect to adding to the demand?... With the exception of the reseller taking the risk of going broke rather than the original seller? Also that the artificial raise in prices caused by resellers buying out more than just the surplus and keeping it until the price raises results in sporadic changes in ticket price.

Ex: Diamonds. There's metric tons of the stuff IN dealer's hands, but 99% of it is "not for sale at the moment." This makes a common stone that people really want keep its value (rather than losing it because literally everyone is selling diamonds.)
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Re: Broken ticket economy?

Postby itblobboy » Thu Jun 26, 2014 4:04 pm

Tomatha wrote: literally everyone is selling diamonds.


I think I missed out on that part of humanity somewhere... :roll:

Anyways, most of the people who bought cheap tickets are probably holding onto it waiting for prices to raise patiently. They won't be for sale for a while, but that doens't stop the people who just sell tons of tickets for cheap anyways from continuing that for quite a while.
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Re: Broken ticket economy?

Postby ChronoVenom » Thu Jun 26, 2014 7:49 pm

Robby will make more money off people who want coins because they will have to buy more tickets than before to sell for the same amount of coins.
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Re: Broken ticket economy?

Postby Zywak » Fri Jun 27, 2014 4:19 am

Tomatha wrote:Regarding resellers that aren't selling- Doesn't removing from the supply have a very similar effect to adding to the demand?


In case of the diamonds and dealers only selling 1% of what they have to keep prices inflated...De Beers cartel created the demand for diamonds artificially in a very successful marketing campaign that said you must have diamond engagement ring( and marriage is promoted by religion).
There is no such demand for tickets, you dont have to buy spawn balls or evo crystals. If you meet someone awsome in HH, there is no public expectation for you to go sit in a room together and share a spawn ball or two. There is also no expectation for having double drop or 60% resell or spiky hair or anything. If tickets cost goes out of hand because sellers are bogarting 99% of the tickets- people just wont buy.
If tickets cost 100k, i wouldn't have bought 60% resale because it would start making profit for me only when i earned 172+ million after the purchase and i'm pretty sure i wont earn that much while i play this game.

Caefer wrote:*Facepalm* not really, it just means they can sell more tickets in a shorter amount of time and people will buy them just because they are cheap. That all means they make more total money (because who can resist a good deal?)

What i meant in my statement was that in vacuum low cost tickets mean the game is less to win.
1000 tickets * 10000 coins = 10 million coins - less game value for same amount of real money aka less pay-to-win
1000 tickets * 20000 coins = 20 million coins - more game value for same amount of real money aka more pay-to-win

When introducing the HH environment into the formulae...
Well, i dare you to calculate what are the less pay-to-win and more pay-to-win ranges in ticket cost accounting for all the factors(supply/demand averages, already existing ticket amount, average coin income per player, levelling speed boost factor for faster ticket sales for low price and slower sales for higher price etc).
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Re: Broken ticket economy?

Postby Tomatha » Fri Jun 27, 2014 5:45 am

Zywak wrote:
Tomatha wrote:Regarding resellers that aren't selling- Doesn't removing from the supply have a very similar effect to adding to the demand?


In case of the diamonds and dealers only selling 1% of what they have to keep prices inflated...De Beers cartel created the demand for diamonds artificially in a very successful marketing campaign that said you must have diamond engagement ring( and marriage is promoted by religion).
There is no such demand for tickets, you dont have to buy spawn balls or evo crystals. If you meet someone awsome in HH, there is no public expectation for you to go sit in a room together and share a spawn ball or two. There is also no expectation for having double drop or 60% resell or spiky hair or anything.


While it's true that there definitely not to that extreme, there's a bit of pressure not to be outdated for some members
Spoiler: show
since this game is so heavily ticket to win. (I say ticket rather than pay because grinding is a legit alternative... assuming time isn't an issue) Ex: Triple guild money is suggested in order to stay appealing as a top-guild, though not forced.
Extreme Scenario: if payvault got something that made every drop item drop two of the same item rather than one, and buying tickets wasn't an option, and tickets showed no downward trend, the higher-ups may feel pressured to buy the item anyways, regardless of price (to a reasonable point).

Obviously, several of these factors do not take place, this is more aimed at if there was a HoF'er that couldn't donate and a market where re-sellers successfully bought out all fair-priced tickets.

Also, we need a massively priced consumable (Do I smell 1-hour attack doubling potion?)

The potion is a joke, but we really do need an expensive consumable...
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